Author Topic: Bike Motivation Problems.  (Read 2241 times)

Offline Brock

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Bike Motivation Problems.
« on: June 12, 2020, 06:45:33 PM »
As some of you may recall, after I came back from Thailand in January I had problems with the bike not wanting to move.

The first place I started looking, was the clutch. I took the front of the bike off, including right exhaust and crash bar just to get at one clutch bolt. (sorry no pics of this journey) The clutch was disassembled, and all the components were examined and worn parts replaced ( about $300 worth). All bits refitted and buttoned up, and guess what?? Something was still slipping and grinding..

Oh well, next likely culprit was probably the rear wheel drive spline, so out with the tools and off with the brakes and wheel....
Brake pads were a bit worn, so I decided to get replacements from Metal gear for that. On looking at the drive spline, I noticed a some what scary saw tooth gear arrangement. Not good so pull it off and the cush rubbers as they were a bit cracked and worn and sat back to wait for the parts to arrive at Honda. Not too bad a wait, only two weeks and the gave me a good discount on the parts.
Parts arrived, fitted and back wheel in. Push the wheel to see if everything was seated and the dreaded graunch clunk was still there.  So off the wheel came, examine everything and found that the right hand axle spacer was in backwards. Turn it around assemble, Fault still there.

Bugger, I need a beer, and maybe an ST1300 in white.
Brock
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Offline Brock

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2020, 07:05:27 PM »
After a few days, I pulled the wheel off again, and pulled the cover plate off the diff to check the internal spline of the crown wheel and try its fit to the rear drive spline. All good, fits just like it should, put everything back and still no good.

Last Saturday, at the Bindoon RTE I mentioned the slight problem (well its only been off the road for 6 months) to the guys where Wombat (Bill ) said he would pop around to have a look and see if he could come up with anything.

Today, 12/06/20 Bill and WAG arrived at 0900, and it was out with the rattle gun ( gotta love the Ryobi battery jobby, it make life easier) and tools. Brakes off, Axle nut off (its easier to remove the brake calliper with the axle bolt out), wheel off and drive spline off.

Trial fit the drive spline into the diff, to make sure the fit was good ( all ok) open the diff, take out crown wheel and make sure it meshing properly , it was. I tried a screw driver on the pinion gear and still could get the graunch/clunk.... Problem not in the diff or back wheel.

Next step was to separate the diff housing from the driveshaft/swing arm. Not a hard job, four nuts (a bit awkward but doable with the exhaust still fitted) and the diff popped off.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2020, 11:35:41 PM by Brock »
Brock
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Offline Brock

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2020, 07:17:59 PM »
Well thats it then, an very rusty worn drive shaft coupling. Check out the state of the oil seal...



It took a good sized shifter and a few well placed whacks with a hammer by WAG to pop it off as well as a lot of rusty dust.

The Whole coupling assy together.



The inside of the diff coupling, has seen better days. Note the two holes in the bottom, they were clogged with rusty dust.



The coupling from the other side. The two holes are to pick up oil from the diff and lubricate the splines as the swing arm bobs up and down on the road. That hasnt been happening for some time I would say.

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Offline Brock

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2020, 07:30:17 PM »
A big thanks to Wombat and WAG for their assistance this morning, it was greatly appreciated.

I have been to West coast Honda to order the parts needed, ($312.00) they will be here early September...  Yep 2.5 months as they have to come from Japan.

Why not order from the States you say (They arent shipping at the moment) Or David Silver Spares?? (exchange rate and shipping costs).

So before the year is out, I will have saved a lot of money in fuel (not riding anywhere) and mechanic fees (I'm doing the work with some help).

Something to take away from this, if your bike wont move and has a juddering noise from the back end, check the drive splines and the drive shaft coupling. If the lubrication holes are blocked, you will be getting excessive wear in there and you could be caught out a long way from home.

If you have the opportunity to pull the diff off, do it and inspect the couplings. Its better to do that and be able to keep riding than get stranded.


Back to your regular programming..

Oh, by the way the repair manual says you need a special tool to remove the diff coupling. The special tool is a Ryobi battery rattle gun, an extension and a 14mm socket and its off.
Brock
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Offline Shiney

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2020, 05:31:52 PM »
Awesome work diagnosing the problem and getting the bike ready for the new parts guys :thumbsup
Shame about the wait but the main thing is that you can fix it :runyay

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Offline Brock

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2020, 07:05:49 PM »
Quote
main thing is that you can fix it

Yes We Can.....

Now I sound like Bob the builder.... :fp :fp :fp
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Offline Shiney

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2020, 08:30:52 PM »
 :crackup   :rofl   :crackup   :rofl   :crackup   :rofl   :crackup   :rofl
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Offline Yorkie

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2020, 09:25:06 PM »
At least you have been through everything, now it will last another 50 years
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Offline Brock

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2020, 09:54:40 PM »
Quote
now it will last another 50 years

At least another 200000 Ks Yorkie. (I might not last that long but.)

I may even change the timing belt, and spark plugs..... Dont want to go overboard but
 o:) o:)
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Offline Biggles

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2020, 11:52:42 PM »
Whew!!  I'm amazed it kept going at all, with all that corrosion and lack of lubricant.  While it's an appalling thing to see, it's a testament to Honda's engineering and metallurgy that it functioned, albeit noisily.
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Offline Brock

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2020, 12:31:38 AM »
There was no noise until it failed. I dont know if the drive shaft coupling had too much moly put on during install that blocked the holes from new, but the rust and muck that came out definitely prevented and lubrication getting to the splines.

Its definitely worth taking the diff off and checking the splines every now and then while the wheel is off. It only takes about 30 min to get the wheel off, and get the diff off to check it, then another 30 min to reassemble if all ok. 

If its evident that there is a lubrication fault, its then a simple job to remove the couplings, replace the oil seal (if needed) clean out the lubrication ports and reassemble ( and lubricate) before major damage occurs. You only need a rattle gun and a suitable socket (14mm I think) plus a little grease and oil.
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Offline Wombat

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2020, 10:37:20 AM »
just a quick note about the seals etc. The seal on the diff coupling must be at the very top so that it runs above the oil hole pickup and at the step in the coupling. If you look at the photo of Brocks it appears that the seal may be too low and has blocked the oil holes. The rust above the small groove ( on the left hand side ) is where the seal should have been. When the diff hub is put back onto the swingarm it is advisable to put the axle in to align the hub before tightening otherwise it may be hard  to put the axle and wheel on. Trust me I have learnt from experience.  :fp
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Offline Brock

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2020, 11:07:22 AM »
I will be doing a trial fit of the diff coupling, to see where it mates with the oil seal. If there is a problem, I will have to try and remove the weird nut that sits on the seal and replace it. ( more special tools, a hammer and drift may suffice)
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Offline ST1100_GREG

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2020, 01:36:29 PM »
Wow what an experience. Thanks for sharing this Brock. It may just save a life as not having the coupling coupled at the worst time could be fatal. More picks when you reassemble please.
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Offline Brock

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2020, 02:54:21 PM »
Quote
not having the coupling coupled at the worst time could be fatal

Not so sure about that, but it could leave you stranded somewhere unpleasant, with very limited recovery options. The symptoms were sort of like a slipping clutch, with a bit of juddering as the teeth lost grip/mesh.

I dont think it would have lasted long enough to get into a situation like overtaking up hill at 110Ks and suddenly losing drive. The problem should have started to show before then.
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Offline ST1100_GREG

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Re: Bike Motivation Problems.
« Reply #15 on: June 16, 2020, 02:57:30 PM »
I was thinking like failing mid intersection where you pause to let traffic through when turning and blah nothing. Stranded, in the dark.. : spooky

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