Electrics not so electric

[Beefa (IanN)]

Hi one and all.

Last thursday night after prepearing the ST for a weekend away I could'nt resist a quick late night ride. After about 20 minutes the engine started to miss, I asumed it was fouled pluges and made a mental note to check the before I left in the morning. After that things went south quickly as I headed for home. Headlights got progressivley dimer I lost dash lights and less than 2 km from home she stoped all together.  I got her home with the help of and angry wife and the battery out of my commuter GSX 650F .

On inspection in the morning I found this



and



and when I took the plug off the regulator this



I know nothing about electricals at all. Dose this sort of damage look related to the old 28amp altenator or is it just a regulator that has gone. How dose one check, through reading on line I now know that you can't get a 28amp altenator, that a new regulator is over $120.00 and that a 40amp altenator has a regulator built in and will fit in my ST with some modification.

All I know is that my ST don't go. Can anyone give me any hints or tests to try and work out what to do.

Thanks Guys

Beefa

[Brock]

As I recal, that is a fairly common problem on the older ST1100s ( according to the US site) A replacement reg and a repaired plug and you should be OK

[Beefa (IanN)]

Thanks Brock

Just have to track one down now

Beefa

[saaz]

That style of alternator is prone to heat build up in the connections, which can lead to regulator failure. My Suzuki has a similar system, and soldering up the connections helped, as the bullet connectors always were hot to the touch.

Have you tried to clean up the connections and check whether it charges? If you know anyone with a multi meter there are some tests that can be done. The regulator is probably gone though. If you can try and get the police version, as it is heavier duty and less prone to overheating and failure, but it does not put out any extra power.

[RubenCan]

Beefa, the exact same thing happened to me last year. I was off the road for about 5 months. Originally I went to a mechanic that by the time  he had charged $300 in labour we concluded that he did not know how much more it would cost (parts and labour)
So yours truly began his homework;
1.  I have a 1992 model that "used" to gave the same 28amp alternator that you have.
2. In my case, the voltage regulator was fried and that would have cost a little over $100 to replace. the problem was in getting a replacement  connector (mine melted like yours). This issue could have been prevented by spraying (didnt know about this beforehand) a silicone anticorrosive spray. As the connectors corrode they begin to retain heat due to greater resistance until they begin to melt. My 28amper was tested an some damage had occurred. I waited for a couple of months to see if a wiring harness came up but decided to bite the bullet and try to go for the upgrade.
3. I found a partial wiring harness that includes a new 50amp fuse holder(40 and 28 are different) at a wreckers in silverwater rd, silverwater.
4. The 40 amp alternator gears that go into the engine are different as they are sealed unlike the 28 amper that are open as the engine oil circulates around the alternator innards.
5. That meant that i had to get an alternator and gears. David Silver in the UK had a new 40 amper that would cost au$990 including postage. I was lucky to find (through ebay) the gears in Germany for au$70 delivered and the alternator from a wreckers for au$280.
6. once I had the parts, it took me two full days of much cursing taking out exhaust, swingarm/driveshaft and old alternator including the stuffed wiring and placing everything back in. the new alternator id physically larger and takes a lot of patience to get it in.

I figured that since not many mechanics get their hands on this bike I would not have had much change from $2000 due to parts and labour.

To cut a long story short, I'm happy to come along and lend a hand. I have the tools to remove the swing arm. I reckon I could get this done in one very long day now.

[RubenCan]

Just found an alternator but it is a bit too expensive;
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1995-2003-HONDA-ST1100-PAN-EUROPEAN-40AMP-ALTERNATOR-VERY-GOOD-301-/321542308005?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts_13&hash=item4add6a40a5

[RubenCan]

Here is a 28 amp unit;
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Pan-European-ST1100-H-1990-Alternator-Generator-Outer-Case-Stator-28A-/331313136190?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts_13&hash=item4d23cd423e

and a regulator rectifier;
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/RICKS-REGULATOR-RECTIFIER-HONDA-ST1100-1990-1995-/271143156748?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3f21643c0c
 Although phoning around wreckers may yield good results

[Brock]

Rubencan,

That 28Amp unit is only the stator, its missing the other spinny half..

[RubenCan]

Brocky, its only the stator that stuffs up, the rest which one heavy magnet is fine to remain on the bike

[RubenCan]

Here is the new stuff for the 28amp, mind you the connector is not available

http://www.partzilla.com/parts/detail/honda/HP-31130-MT3-003.html
http://www.partzilla.com/parts/detail/honda/HP-91306-MS2-611.html
http://www.partzilla.com/parts/detail/honda/HP-31600-MS2-601.html

[johnnyYTED]

 
Beefa and Ruben I'm happy to come help doing the fix as I'm only 5 mins from Ian, and I also have the know how after Abe taught me and we did my Alt,,,
  juST not the IBA weekend 17th> 20th.. any time after  though  or early next week... is ok.

[RubenCan]

Nice one johnny, there you go Ian, things are starting to look up already. The question will be, repair the 28amp or attempt to replace with a 40 amp. I'm currently waiting for parts from Partzilla myself and expect to be back on the road from Sunday next week so any time after that would be great.

[johnnyYTED]

 
  Ruben would any of the parts of the ST that is being dismantled in Marrickville have anything usable..  juST a thought to help Ian out.. but my memory cant think of the members name..

[RubenCan]

Bingo, lets ask Shaun, that is a 40amper

[nate]

Beat me to it Rubén, was just about to say ask Shaun! Best of luck.  I also know there is two wrecks in Sydney at one of the wreckers (name escapes me). If I think of it I'll let you know.


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[RubenCan]

Thanks Nate

[Beefa (IanN)]

Gentelmen

You guys never cease to amaze me.  Thank you all so much.

I'm have located 2 ST1100 being wrecked as Metropolitan Motorcycle Wreckers at Silverwater,
and am hoping to pick up a 40amp unit today with the wirering harness .

Again thank you so much.

Beefa

[RubenCan]

Awesome news Ian. Fun times are a coming. The below links will give you a taste of what is to come although I tried for three days to remove the lewis pin and in the end finished taking the sump off then it tokk 5 seconds to have it done, go figure. I wasted three days  and a considerable amount of swearing because i did not want to buy a new gasket for the sump....which didn't do anyway as I used silicone paste to put it back in.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANHdAGDuYMg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANHdAGDuYMg

[Brock]

If you have a look at the US site, there is a tool that you can use to make it easier to install. You will have to make it but.

[saaz]

I have seen jobs where an extension to a rachet is used to spread the gears enough to allow replacing the alternator, so the lewis pin is not a necessity but comes in the kit that circulates over in the US.

[nate]

Gentelmen

You guys never cease to amaze me.  Thank you all so much.

I'm have located 2 ST1100 being wrecked as Metropolitan Motorcycle Wreckers at Silverwater,
and am hoping to pick up a 40amp unit today with the wirering harness .

Again thank you so much.

Beefa

That must have been the wreckers I was thinking about. I bought a radiator fan from one of those.


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[Beefa (IanN)]

Ok the story so far,

I spoke with the John at Metropolitan Motorcycle Wreckers at 8.00am this morning and he told me they had 2 ST1100s in stock one a 98 and the other a 99.
He told me to come after 11.30 as he "had to whip it out" and he would need "about an hour and a bit". I got there at 12.00 with Rooster and my name was mud .

He had only just got the swing arm off as I arived and to make maters worse it was the only ST1100 they had as one had been sold compleati-ish a week or 2 ago.
As he was explaing this to me I'm looking at the bike in question and rea;lise that it is a 1990 model in Sparkle Silver with 51000km on the clock. So I pointed that out to him and explained the difference and we even looked at the copmplince plate.

He was not happy, but Rooster pointed out that the Regulator and plug were in pristine condition so I bought them both and with the money left over I bought 2 side covers a Left pocket and a tank cove.

While we were there John tested the altenator and it came as perfect so we discussed how to go about the removal of the altenator from the bike, he was going to continue that on monday.

Long story short got home spliced the new plug into the wiring loom Rooster did a static test and the altenator is fine put the regulator in got it all back together and on test it was charging at 14.98V at 5000rpmand 13.20 at idle.

So for less than the $300 quoted I'm back on the road with the Silver Fox looking the best she has looked in years and I know where to get a perfectly good altenator if needed.

I want to thank everyone for their imput and offers of help. It has been a realy humbling experince for me and I truly appreciate it. And if the the time comes that I need to replace the altenator my wife will cook up a storm for all who help and I allways have a keg of 2 in the fridge for after.

Beefa

[johnnyYTED]

 
great outcome Beefa,,  lucky you were spared the expense and all 
one would have thought a bike wrecker would have the right tools and know what they're doing,,