Post by: Piet on April 30, 2015, 10:18:53 PM
Post by: Shiney on May 01, 2015, 01:55:55 AM
Post by: Piet on May 02, 2015, 03:10:06 PM
The speed rating is Q so to a max of 99 MPH or 160 kph.
The load rating is 101 so 825 kgs.
The trye tread pattern is called CSR71 http://austonetire.com/products-view.aspx?id=116 (http://austonetire.com/products-view.aspx?id=116)
I paid $100.00. I also purchased a week prior a Michelin Commander II (cruzer tyre) 160/70-17 standard tyre for $239.00 and that was cheap because most wanted to charge $269.00
Interestingly having two brand new tyres to compare I measured the thread depth of both. The Michelin has a 6.6 mm depth and the Austone has an 8.6 mm depth so a 30% increase on the Michelin.
I have not yet mounted the Austone on a rim, but if my understanding is correct, it will stand 13mm taller, 15mm wider and drop wheel revs per distance travelled by 2%.
Speedo being front wheel on the ST11, it will still read correctly and engine revs lowered a tad for a given road speed.
Of course I will be tracking milage carefully and reporting on handling, just remember I am more a tourer than peg scraper.
Post by: StinkyPete on May 02, 2015, 03:24:17 PM
Post by: Piet on May 02, 2015, 03:28:30 PM
Post by: StinkyPete on May 02, 2015, 03:40:35 PM
Post by: Biggles on May 03, 2015, 01:17:00 PM
:popcorn
I trust it's just an academic interest! :eek
The thought of leaning on a tyre that is cooperating by distorting its walls doesn't sound like my idea of safe engineering.
Post by: StinkyPete on May 03, 2015, 05:47:38 PM
My advice from a Forensic Vehicle Examiner is that darkside is legal, but I would not be prepared to do it on my ST and sacrifice my sharp handling just to save a few dollars.
Post by: Piet on May 03, 2015, 06:31:25 PM
I know full well this is one of those topics that many just feel they have to express a strong opinion, to which they are entitled, but have not perhaps had first hand experience. I have not had that experience yet I am going to obtain it. In the mean time, I am unable to offer a comment too strongly without knowing what I am talking about. When it comes to the Darkside I would need to know just what it feels like and be experienced enough to make a valued comment.
When it come to motor cycles, what I do know is that from day one guys have made modifications, additions farkels, choppers, bobbers, cafe racers, you name it they have done it. I love that about bikes and it applies to all motor heads. Tyres on bikes initially used car tyre technology. The Michelin web site make this comment about tyre construction. (Not application specific)
"A radial tire allows the sidewall and the tread to function as two independent features of the tire."
"A bias tire consists of multiple rubber plies over lapping each other. The crown and sidewalls are interdependent. The overlapped plies form a thick layer that is less flexible and more sensitive to overheating."
With radials on bike car truck and tractor now becoming the norm, some side wall flex is definitely engineered into all radials. It is funny, but I bet there has been many a person who may have made comments like "Jamming an 1100cc water cooled car engine into a bikes frame is sheer madness".
He was probably correct but I tell you straight up, it is a madness I share with great passion".
May we one an all enjoy the ride and let the rubber hit the road.
Post by: winston66 on May 03, 2015, 09:44:24 PM
A thought from Winston66,
I have two identical ST1300 motorcycles ,apart from some cosmetics , and some minor mechanical modifications and with an age difference of 4 years.
One of these rides is fitted with the optional Darksiders rear tire, so I have been able to test and compare and qualify the various aspects of this sort of modification to a high powered modern Touring motorcycle.
I will not enter into any argument or speculation as to which, how , or where, either or the other, is better , worse , safer, or in any way different , to the other.
I feel that the whole premise, of which , or where, is open and over to the driver to experience and make a judgment for them selves.
.
In reference to the proceeding post of Piet's
Which mentioned cross ply tires, (in regard to cars, I think)?
This brings me to the question that I waned to ask.
Can anyone tell me , without starting an argument.
How many and what manufacturers and brands of motorcycle tire are RADIAL construction, and similarly how many manufacturers and brands of similar sizes of motorcycle tires are of a cross ply construction?
can anyone quantify a list, for those that might be interested, in possibly comparing the relative benefits of either type of construction in the manufacturer of motorcycle tires.
Cheers to all
Winston 66, Northampton Western Australia
:rd13 :think1 :OldMan
Post by: winston66 on May 03, 2015, 09:55:33 PM
In regard to my previous post, where I mention CROSS PLY TIRES, I meant to say , BIAS CONSTRUNCTION,
Cheers , Winston66
Post by: Diesel on May 04, 2015, 11:45:00 AM
I have toyed with this thought myself - especially if towing a bike trailer for a lap of Oz.
In these vids - I can't see at any time where the car tyre has less road contact than a bike tyre...
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I also have 2 questions - why a Goldwing rim? Is there no darkside tyre to suit ST rim?
Thanks for posting. :thumbs
Cheers, Dissel
Post by: saaz on May 04, 2015, 03:13:52 PM
The ST1300 is a lot easier to find tyres for.
Years ago I tried the first 'radial' motorcycle tyres, the Pirelli MP7s. They were fantastic with grip and life, and far better in the we than bias tyres at the time. Motorcycle radial tyres are not true radials like car ones, as a motorcycle tyre need some bias type construction in there. GT versions of raiald tend to have a bit more bias construction but with some radial benefits.
The ST1100 came out with bias tyres, but radial tyres have been used successfully for years. Personally, I would never go back to bias tyres.
Some discussion on the differences and benefits
http://www.revzilla.com/common-tread/why-things-are-bias-ply-and-radial-tires (http://www.revzilla.com/common-tread/why-things-are-bias-ply-and-radial-tires)
Post by: winston66 on May 04, 2015, 04:17:18 PM
:runyay :rd13 :OldMan
Winston66 here,
About the insurance question,
Shannons,
My insurance company said to me=
We will insure and cover any modification that you make to your vehicle providing that the mods. are LEGAL.
.
That said , when I advised them about my fitment of a car type tire to the ST the subsequent endorsement that they placed on my policy document for that Motorcycle, stated that the Motorcycle . was fitted with a MOTOR VEHICLE TIRE !!!!!!!
Now I ask you--
What is it about a motorcycle in that it is somehow different to, and is not classified as a motor vehicle?
DO you get the drift of my question?
Is this any food for thought.
Cheers Winston66
:rd13 :wht13 :think1
Post by: Piet on May 05, 2015, 10:30:24 AM
Guys the data might be incorrect so PLEASE make corrections. I just wanted to get the list started.
Post by: Piet on May 05, 2015, 10:47:02 AM
Diesel, I tend to agree that contact area looks pretty good. Gone are the days when I used to like scraping the pegs. I no longer want scar tissue like what I have in my left hip where bitumen & road grim now look like a badly smudged tattoo. Quite content to stay upright. So it all depends on riding style and what we might want out of the ride.
In answer to the question regarding the GL rim. Due to the ST11 being fairly narrow in the swingarm, you cant get a CT narrow enough to fit the std 17" rim. Going to the GL 16" rim you can get some tyres 175/xx-16 that will work.
I am planning on having everything set-up so I can swap over really quickly. I will maintain the ability to run standard rim/sizing and then swap over to the GL/CT. In fact I have just purchased from Shaun his rear brake hanger so that I don't have to touch my original hanger.
Post by: Piet on May 10, 2015, 09:59:58 PM
This first photo shows both the standard wheel with Michelin Commander II 160/70-17 and the 16" Gold Wing rim with 175-75-16 car tyre fitted. Both have new bearings, oil seals, cushion rubbers and the 3rd "O" ring fitted. You will note that the Darkside tyre is a bit taller.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6909_zpsvpwsnmsw.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6909_zpsvpwsnmsw.jpg.html)
A 2nd shot showing the tread patterns and the difference in height.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6907_zpsuec5sf1w.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6907_zpsuec5sf1w.jpg.html)
This last shot is just the flip side of the wheels. I wanted to take the photo's prior to some rain that was coming so I had not finished putting in the cushion rubbers on the ST rim, and the retainer.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6905_zps9cpakr1y.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6905_zps9cpakr1y.jpg.html)
All that remains is the machining but I might be a bit delayed on this. As soon as I get that done I will post a few more photo's.
Post by: Shiney on May 12, 2015, 06:22:25 PM
:popcorn :popcorn :popcorn
Post by: Piet on May 26, 2015, 08:44:38 PM
Post by: Piet on June 02, 2015, 09:30:43 PM
First up is the spacer / thrust washer that leaves the drive spline fully engaged yet moves the wheel over by ¼ inch.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6939_zpssaiql1vr.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6939_zpssaiql1vr.jpg.html)
It does not need the bevel on the edge, but it makes no difference.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6940_zpstfopox4w.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6940_zpstfopox4w.jpg.html)
Thrust washer inserted.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6956_zpss1equ9rw.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6956_zpss1equ9rw.jpg.html)
Now its time to attach it to the wheel. Please note that the grey/white thrust washer is now between the bearing and drive spline unit.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6957_zps0zzvtha6.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6957_zps0zzvtha6.jpg.html)
Next is the slip fit spacer that goes over the final drive's axel collar and also adds ¼ inch to move the rim over to the left.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6941_zps9s4goqdw.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6941_zps9s4goqdw.jpg.html)
It slips over by about ¼ inch and extends the collar by ¼ inch.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6943_zpslz0f0syo.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6943_zpslz0f0syo.jpg.html)
This photo is of course the std rear drive shaft spline and the axel collar in the middle.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6954_zpsihare5pg.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6954_zpsihare5pg.jpg.html)
Collar extension slipped on and in place.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6955_zpsgqb4lff9.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6955_zpsgqb4lff9.jpg.html)
That takes care of the ¼ inch shift to the left.
Now because the GL1500 rim is 1" narrower that the std ST11 rim ... we need to make a replacement left side axel spacer that inserts in the LHS oil seal and butts up to the brake calliper. This next shot shows the original on the left and the new unit on the right being 25.4mm longer than the original.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6947_zpsgpgyxe1i.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6947_zpsgpgyxe1i.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6944_zps37nk8d7r.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6944_zps37nk8d7r.jpg.html)
Lastly we have to shave off ¼ inch off the brake calliper.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6948_zpsbwp1u1q1.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6948_zpsbwp1u1q1.jpg.html)
I wanted to also machine up ¼ washers so I could go back to standard dimensions and wheel in a flash.
This is the washer for the calliper mount on the axel.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6950_zpsdbx8ruog.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6950_zpsdbx8ruog.jpg.html)
This is the same for the brake calliper locking pin.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6951_zpsaic2p8o9.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6951_zpsaic2p8o9.jpg.html)
Just in case anyone is interested, If they has an ABS-TCS brake calliper the ¼ shave is required but the calliper is slightly different. This next shot is the ABS-TCS 3 pot calliper bracket.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6952_zpsltig2ase.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6952_zpsltig2ase.jpg.html)
Side by Side:
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6953_zpst1ejwyqd.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6953_zpst1ejwyqd.jpg.html)
Line it all up and slip the axel through:
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6961_zpsug708thn.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/IMG_6961_zpsug708thn.jpg.html)
Post by: West Aussie Glen on June 02, 2015, 11:46:10 PM
Post by: Shiney on June 03, 2015, 08:34:06 AM
opcorn opcorn opcornSent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk
Post by: Col on August 10, 2015, 04:12:11 PM
However I do like leaning my bike on corners (Yes, weird but true) and his bike is a Victory cruiser, not a sports tourer. He had it over scraping the footpegs and looks comfortable doing it, but my bike leans further on its sidestand than the Victory does when cornering so if your riding style is cruising, try the darkside. Plenty of people have and love it. If a suitable tyre fitted without those modifications I'd give it a go.
Post by: mr2u on March 29, 2016, 11:20:31 PM
Have you stuck with the CT or gone back to a MCT ?
If you have stayed with the car tyre, how has the experience been? any pros or cons?
Mr2u
:blk13
Post by: Col on March 29, 2016, 11:38:32 PM
Post by: Piet on March 30, 2016, 09:20:01 AM
Regarding the Darkside ... I am a bit of a fan to be honest. I am very happy with the final result. I am running at 26 PSI and I cant really fault it.
At first with immediate change from bike tyre to car tyre ... the feel is quite different. But that is true for any change ie. Avon to Michelin, even old to new staying with the same brand. It always feels different.
First impressions: Easier to hold upright when at the lights or pulled over toward the side especially when the road falls away. A std bike tyres round profile means the legs do it all when holding the bike upright. On the CT with the larger flat surface it lightly adds just a bit of self support with a noticeable reduction to the effort needed to hold her upright.
Slipping up between cars at the lights was a bit interesting at first due to what felt like railroading. What is was is often the tarmac is pushed out to the sides due to heavy vehicles. The flatter CT tends to ride up a bit and pushes you around. It did not take too long to get used to that.
I like the rear brake as it seems a tad better due to the larger contact area.
Tyre life is heaps better. I haven't worn the first one out yet, and a little later I might modify this post and insert the kms to date.
Please understand I am not one who rides scraping the pegs. I am happy enough though to give her heaps of throttle in a corner and just power away. I cant fault the grip when dry. When wet I am cautious in the extreme because I am just not interested in meeting the road on my side with any kind of tyre. I can't report any negatives with the CT because I am never that close to the limits.
All things considered ... I am extremely happy with my CT and will stick with it. Its also not bad having a complete wheel ready to fit if I get a flat going back to the standard wheel.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/Dark_zpssh36tm69.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/Dark_zpssh36tm69.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah174/ST1100PY/My%20Bike/Darkside/Side_zpsueu3tm6v.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/ST1100PY/media/My%20Bike/Darkside/Side_zpsueu3tm6v.jpg.html)
These photo's shows the current tread after just over 3000 kms.