OzSTOC
Honda ST1100 Section => Suspension ST1100 => Topic started by: Streak on February 21, 2012, 09:03:11 PM
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I noticed after my trip to Nambucca and back my rear suspension was soft, and it is set up for pillion/carrying extra gear, then it dawned on me that my rear shock was almost 16 years old on my 1996 ST1100
Any advice on what I can upgrade to or hints on setting up properly?
Cheers
Streak
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RAD in Brisbane can do rebuilds of the OEM shock, and can also change the spring if you need a heavier one. This would be the cheapest option, but I have heard that the life of the rebuild might vary, but it may do what you want. I have a spare OEM shock you could borrow if you don't want to be off the road for too long (I think it is my original, but as I have lent it to a few people it may not be!). After that Hagon make replacement shocks that seem good value but not the latest or greatest.
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Hi,
If ever I get rich then this will replace mine. But at the moment my priority is getting stuff ready for timing belt replacement in 10,000k's time
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/360393864521?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/360393864521?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649)
and these for the front though I have no prob with front yet.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/PROGRESSIVE-FRONT-FORK-SPRINGS-1991-2002-HONDA-ST1100-/250740987991?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3a6153d857 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/PROGRESSIVE-FRONT-FORK-SPRINGS-1991-2002-HONDA-ST1100-/250740987991?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3a6153d857)
I only notice occaisional rear shock bottoming out when partner is on board and she complains suspension is set to firm. But our minor sealed roads aren't the best in SA
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Thank you gents for the advice, I need to do something I think, I actually bottomed out once or twice on the trip, and it was only me with full panniers and top box.
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Thank you gents for the advice, I need to do something I think, I actually bottomed out once or twice on the trip, and it was only me with full panniers and top box.
That's still quite a substantial load!!
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well i have the report back from Toowoomba Honda.....rear shock is shot to hell,
Honda Replacement shock is $570 2 weeks delivery from Japan
Ikon Shock: $520 1 weeks Delivery
So it looks like i might have to go looking for a cheaper option as that is wayyyyy dear, that does not include fitting
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Without a new spring the RAD rebuilt should be $150 or so (maybe less). A heavier spring would be extra.
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Without a new spring the RAD rebuilt should be $150 or so (maybe less). A heavier spring would be extra.
My problem is that i suffer from lack of skills to remove, and lack of workshop as well, my bike shop is more than happy to fit something for me if I can source a replacement shock. good lads actually they dont get bent out of shape with outsourced items, they are happy to do business
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The rear shock is dead easy to remove, no need for a workshop.
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Can I ask what the process is?
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The rear shock is dead easy to remove, no need for a workshop.
Will send you PDF file for shock replacement by pm
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Or have a look at section 14 of the ST1100 manual.
Paraphrase :-
Put bike on centre stand
Take off right side cover
back off spring preload to lowest setting
place jack under swing arm to take the load
remove lower shock bolt
remove upper shock bolt
shock comes out.
put back in reverse
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Or have a look at section 14 of the ST1100 manual.
Paraphrase :-
Put bike on centre stand
Take off right side cover
back off spring preload to lowest setting
place jack under swing arm to take the load
remove lower shock bolt
remove upper shock bolt
shock comes out.
put back in reverse
nice, and knowing me....i would do that all arse about face! might be an good RTE to my house to have all the Queenslanders laughing at me trying to do it, RTE and a show
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nice, and knowing me....i would do that all arse about face! might be an good RTE to my house to have all the Queenslanders laughing at me trying to do it, RTE and a show
What the "To Eat" part? The "show" might be crap :p
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Well I have spoken to Rodney from RAD Motorcycle Shock repairs (07 3892 6493), will cost between 150-200 dollars, turn around time frame is around a week or two.
So I am pulling the old shock out today and sending it up to him to get it reconditioned, we shall see what the result is, several people have told me he does an excellent job.
So I should be back on the road in time for skips ride in the middle of march.
Cheers
Streak
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This doesn't look too bad?
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/New-Progressive-465-Rear-Shock-Honda-ST-1100-/360393864521?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item53e925f549#ht_1769wt_1185 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/New-Progressive-465-Rear-Shock-Honda-ST-1100-/360393864521?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item53e925f549#ht_1769wt_1185)
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RAD do a good job mine has been done by them for several years
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PROBLEM!!!!!
i pulled the Shock out, no drama's at all, then found the bottom bolt was just turning in the slot, pulled out the bolt and it has sheared off in the slot.
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd499/ozstoc/005-2.jpg)
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd499/ozstoc/004-1.jpg)
Help me! i don't have cash to screw this up.....how do i get this out without making a mess, or do i suck it up and take it down to the bike shop?
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You should be able to ask around some mates to see who has an easy out extractor or similar. Make sure to use a punch to make a mark on the bolt before driling out, as destroying the thread is not good. Make sure you use a sharp drill bit and preferrably a mains powered drill as they have more grunt. The bolt material is tough but doable. Sparay some CRC or WD40 on it now to free it up until you can find an extractor. There are other ways such as heating it up before trying the extractor.
Sometimes just drilling a hole through the stuck bit of the bolt will relive the pressure enough for it to come out, but that looks rusted in. While too late for you, it is worth greasing up the top and bottom bolts on the shock every once in a while - say every seond tyre change. The bolt has a shoulder on it so it is under stress when you do it up - it may have been really over tightened.
You will need to order a new bolt but you probably thought of that.
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Oh Crap!!!!!
That will need to have the rear wheel removed, and the drive separated from the shaft. then take it to a machine shop to drill out the remaining bit of the bolt.
I would attempt it myself, but I have access to people and tools to help. It looks like that bolt has been broken for a long time, an accident waiting to happen me thinks.
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if you get into trouble i have several spare diffs just pm me
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As others have said keep soaking it with penetrant.
(1) Try gentle heat with a gas torch. It'll stuff the paint work around the mount though but you may be able to work it out. Let it cool after each attempt.
(2) Find a bolt that is a similar diameter to the one that's stuck in there. Get a mate with an electric welder to tack it to the seized bolt in a couple of spots. Gently try and turn the bolt out. Keep soaking it as you go. If you use an arc welder don't forget to disconnect the bike's battery.
(3) Use an easy out. I'd gently grind the face of the bolt flat......don't remove too much metal. Punch the centre before drilling. It's going to be tough going with a hand drill as Saaz stated, spray plenty of lubricant into the drill hole as you go.
(4) Throw tools around shed, admit defeat and take offender to local engineering shop.
Good thing you found it before disaster struck!
Good luck!
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This just got me thinking that we should start a bit of a register of people with spare parts sitting around and workshop capability. I have a spare standard shock and a set of exhausts, the left one needing the bracket welded. In only a few months I think Ozstoc has grown to be a resource for older and newer members that is second to none that have been going for years.
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agreed, as my problem, i don't own anything in the way of tools to deal with my problem...
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I have tools and welders, no workshop but
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well i have sat here all afternoon trying to work out what to do, sad to say it but this might put me out of commission for a while, I don't have the access, ability or the tools to do it myself. and I cant justify the amount of cash the bike shop or engineering shop will charge me to fix it.
sighs, frustrated much is all i can say.....
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well i have sat here all afternoon trying to work out what to do, sad to say it but this might put me out of commission for a while, I don't have the access, ability or the tools to do it myself. and I cant justify the amount of cash the bike shop or engineering shop will charge me to fix it.
sighs, frustrated much is all i can say.....
I just had a look at pic of my 1100 from when I did the tyre change. I would definetly check with your local bike shop before you decide anything and you would not be the first this happened to either.
(http://i1082.photobucket.com/albums/j374/alans1100/ST1100ARearTyreChangeOver21stDecember20112.jpg)
It looks like the bolt hole can be accessed from the wheel side of the mounting. Bike shop etc would possible drill the bolt out and hopefully drill to suit size of hole and then clean out the theads with hole tapping tool and fit a new bolt.
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Hey Streak, don't be so fatalist :-(((
It should be as simple as lots of penetrating spray, put a punch mark on the bolt, drill it then use an extraction tool. Must be someone you know or who comes to the shop that could help for a beer or two :beer
As I see it, it is only a relatively simple fix compared to many others :||||
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lol punch mark? extraction tool?
you see i have this magic trick....bike go wrong...i ring magic number....bike go away...bike come back fixed, i give man money.....
marketing and sales are my strength, fix and repair is not something i know w hole lot about lol :whistle
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OK, I will finish off my trailer, throw a few tools in it grab what I dont have and pop over and do the job. I should be back in time to start work tomorrow morning ...... Right?? :grin
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lol punch mark? extraction tool?
you see i have this magic trick....bike go wrong...i ring magic number....bike go away...bike come back fixed, i give man money.....
marketing and sales are my strength, fix and repair is not something i know w hole lot about lol :whistle
I wish I was closer then. I could do with a lot of money ::)
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I am the last person to try to suggest anything and definitely no mechanic, but is that a nut I can sort of see on the other side of the picture? If it is, why can it not be simply wound off with a spanner?
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Just checked on my bike, its not a nut, its a piece of the diff housing that has been tapped for the bolt to screw in to
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OK, thanks Brock. Then from my very limited knowledge, it would have to be penetreen, drill and "easyout" as others have already suggested, but in defence of my ignorance of things mechanical, this has worked for me in the past
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With the wheel out, it could be possible to get at the back of the bolt. with a bit of luck, using a fine bit a pilot hole could be drilled allowing a bigger bit to be chased through.
It sounds easy, but I'm willing to bet its a hardened bolt so that makes things more difficult.
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It definitely is a bolt into a threaded part of the diff. The original bolt is square shouldered so if over tightened can cause problems. That is a known area for corrosion, but more in the UK. As Brock says it will be a hardened bolt so some care is required to get any drilling started right in the centre and not damage the threads, which would need a helicoil or similar thing to fix a buggered thread.
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well i have sat here all afternoon trying to work out what to do, sad to say it but this might put me out of commission for a while, I don't have the access, ability or the tools to do it myself. and I cant justify the amount of cash the bike shop or engineering shop will charge me to fix it.
sighs, frustrated much is all i can say.....
Shearing that bolt is a shame and I can understand your frustration, we've all been there one way or another! But, it's not impossible to fix. Worst case, you can always get a new final drive. There's one on eBay for about $200-ish delivered...
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1993-Honda-ST1100-ST-1100-Final-Drive-/120864103564?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1c240fdc8c#ht_500wt_969 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1993-Honda-ST1100-ST-1100-Final-Drive-/120864103564?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1c240fdc8c#ht_500wt_969)
So if the worst happens and the part gets trashed while trying to remove the bolt, all is not lost.
And if you do fix it yourself, you will have learned a lot along the way.
This experience served as a good prompt for me to apply some anti-seize to my shock mounts.
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Sorry about my previous advice Streak, from the picture you posted I didn't realise one side of the mount was threaded. I thought you had some bolt on the other side to work with.
How difficult is it to remove the final drive housing and take it to a bike dealer or engineering shop for a quote? It's not a big job with the right equipment. The local engineering shop here charges a flat rate of $70 per hour. I don't think it'll be as expensive as you think.
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this happenend to me as well, just turned it out with a pair of pliers. there will be no stress on it now so it should move easily.. if you canot get a new one let me know, there are ways of fixing the old one
paul t
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On my last distance ride with Streak, I noticed his bike looking quite 'spongy' compared to Saaz's ST1100P and mentioned this to these chaps. But I erroneously thought that Saaz had upgraded spring/shock combo rather than Streak's suspension having a failure.
Timely reminder punters that if your ride feels strange or different somehow, there could be a problem, so - it's worth researching/investigating any little niggly problems. Fortunately, Streak's problem was found in time. Good job mate - hope it all goes well and goes quickly for you.
Cheers, Diesel
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You were not that erroneous Diesel as the Fournales shock is a bit of an upgrade to the OEM :rofl
I know you mentioned that mine might be interesting over bumps as it seemed more composed than Streak's...but in fact it rides rough roads like they are not there....the rough down hill part of Thunderbolts aside as it was getting both ends of the bike in the air..all part of the 'fun' :crazy
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Sorry for your demise Streak. Can't help you mate, with anything. I have no idea. I just like riding the things. :blu13
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Any Hints on getting the right hand exhaust off? i have unbolted it at the top, and also loosened the bolts on the bracket underneath, but it seems to be stuck fast.....
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Hey Streak. Your not making early excuses to miss the next RTE are you? :well
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nope i am on for the RTE bolt has been ordered from toowoomba honda, we think we can get the bolt out no worries, just want to get the exhaust off so we can get an easy out in
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Any Hints on getting the right hand exhaust off? i have unbolted it at the top, and also loosened the bolts on the bracket underneath, but it seems to be stuck fast.....
It should kind of twist off/out like the left side, but I found the right side a bit more awkward for some reason.
Try a few gallons of WD40 if the the end can is stuck in the downpipe.
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Well bolt is out, shock is back in as I wanted to test it o make sure it was not the bolt problem with the suspension.
Shock is still pretty average, and I am thinking of getting it rebuilt, but I have a question with the combined weight of myself and mrs streak + gear we won't get much change out of 200kg, is it worth rebuilding a standard shock? Or am I best to replace with an Ikon shock that is a little more heavy duty?
Any and all thoughts appreciated.p
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Its better to run a heavy shock at 50% that a standard at 110%, probably cheaper in the long run.
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The book says maximum cargo weight of about 190kg for an ABS model and about 200kg for a non ABS model. That includes rider, passenger and cargo plus other accessories. So a new (which your isn't) standard shock would cope with that plus a little extra.
I'd advise to go to at least a progressive shock or better when you can afford it.
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Well bolt is out, shock is back in as I wanted to test it o make sure it was not the bolt problem with the suspension.
Shock is still pretty average, and I am thinking of getting it rebuilt, but I have a question with the combined weight of myself and mrs streak + gear we won't get much change out of 200kg, is it worth rebuilding a standard shock? Or am I best to replace with an Ikon shock that is a little more heavy duty?
Any and all thoughts appreciated.p
So how did you get the bolt out?
Personally, I plan to buy a new shock when the standard one has had it's day.
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plenty of WD-40, removed the right muffler (which was an acheivement upon itself), got the drill onto it and got it moving then back it out using small screw driver in the grove from the drill
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Shock is still pretty average, and I am thinking of getting it rebuilt, but I have a question with the combined weight of myself and mrs streak + gear we won't get much change out of 200kg, is it worth rebuilding a standard shock? Or am I best to replace with an Ikon shock that is a little more heavy duty?
Any and all thoughts appreciated.p
Glad to hear you got the bolt out!
If you're happy with the way the OEM shock was performing a rebuild will do the job and probably be much cheaper than replacing it with an aftermarket shock.
However, if you wish to improve your ride you'll notice a substantial improvement in performance with a good aftermarket shock. Most motorcycle suspension manufacturers will be able to advise regarding a suitable spring rate and valving for the type of riding you do, and the sort of loads you carry.
You'll also most likely find that a new rear shock will show up few deficencies in the front end. If the rear shock is shot it's probably time to have the front end serviced as well.
Tony
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as ive watched this disaster turn into a minor inconveniant problem a query for myself has arisan. are st1100p shocks suitable for my st as im useally 2up as this year i have intention of getting the trailer out of mothballs and get out a bit
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The ST1100P shocks are exactly the same as the civilian version. Front end just specifies 10W fork oil rather than 7.5w, but spring rates and valving ar the same. The switch gear and wiring are really the only differences, as alternator etc are the same.
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The ST1100P shocks are exactly the same as the civilian version. Front end just specifies 10W fork oil rather than 7.5w, but spring rates and valving ar the same. The switch gear and wiring are really the only differences, as alternator etc are the same.
Didn't you mention that the fork springs were different on the police-spec bikes? :think1 :cop :law
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The front springs are different from the standard models as they use the early ABS springs, so they are the same as the civilan model. I don't think it was done because they are heavier duty, but I suppose Honda had its reasons.
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Well thanks to some elbow grease, and help from Tipsy, my new shock is in and it is a different bike to ride!
took the bike out myself, and then took teela with me to test it out, and works very well, IKON make a very good shock, the only thing we found it is not as simple as pull it out of the box and put it in.
Start on this side of the bike and remove the Pannier and plastic & Seat
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd499/ozstoc/121.jpg)
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd499/ozstoc/122.jpg)
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd499/ozstoc/123.jpg)
You will also need to loosen the exhaust off as well, don't need to take it off just loosen it so you can get to the bolts around the shock.
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd499/ozstoc/124.jpg)
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd499/ozstoc/125.jpg)
as you can see by the photo below we had to grind the sleeves on the bottom of the shock to get it in, we had to take off about 2mm off either side
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd499/ozstoc/131.jpg)
i dont have photos of the rest as we where trying to get it finished, but i can also say remember to put the shock in with the dampener showing outwards, otherwise you get excellent practice in taking the shock in and out again....
make sure you keep the bike on the centre stand when winding up the shock after you have bolted it in, makes it all very easy to do, we just took it off the centre stand to test the resistance, and put it back on again.
apart from that, it is actually a very simple operation.
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Glad to see it all sorted and Streak that gives me something to look forward to.
One would have thought that after paying a high price for a new shock then it should fit the bike it was designed for without modification.
Just seems strange seeing the coolant overflow next to the rear spring as mine is right behind the motor where the slot is above the RH rear wing. (picture 3)
One minor difference between the 1100 and 1100A then.
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Glad to hear it's not that difficult Streak as I have a 465 Progressive on the way to me now for an operation at the end of the month during two weeks holidays that was planned for FarRiding, but now gonna be for providing the old girl some ST love.
Rear shock, new tyres and hopefully no more lectrik gremlins.
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Most shocks should just go in, but this is the second time in the last few months I have heard that the bottom fitting was too wide and needed adjusting. Its not like ST11s have changed.
Alan, does the A have something else back there instead of the overflow bottle? I have never seen an A without the side cover on. The A also has less space up under the screen if you are trying to fit HID ballasts, horns etc. due to the extra ABS modules.
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Saaz,
What is back there on the A model is something to do with the ABS system. It is more than likely to be the ABS modultor for the rear wheel. There are also two different ABS systems depending on the year. Pre 1996 and post 96 which brings in the 3 piston calipers and linked brakes as well.
Funny the coolant bottle location is not the same for both versions. Doesn't make sense on the production side of things. Two bottles, two sets of hoses etc instead of one for both versions.
I need to check rear brake fluid levels and when I do I get a pic of the RH side without cover for you and post here.
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4134/35727788416_962ed1555a_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Wr9fL1)2012_0413ST1100RH0001 (2) (https://flic.kr/p/Wr9fL1) by Alan (https://www.flickr.com/photos/152195423@N05/), on Flickr
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Thanks. Always help if you know differences in model if trying to help people and they get confused beacuse what they have is different.