Author Topic: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!  (Read 4936 times)

Offline SteveR

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HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« on: October 25, 2015, 01:57:11 AM »
Well, thought I'd quickly post this up before I head off to bed, hopefully I'll have inspired dreams and sort out the problem in the morning in time for a burn out into the country for lunch...

So I'm changing the coolant this afternoon, plastics off, exhaust dropped down (don't have a slim universal joint socket to get to the cylinder drain plugs), old coolant drained, recovery tank emptied, flushed out with the garden hose until clear.  Plugged everything back up and filled with water and a good dose of Tectaloy Mukowt, then fired her up and let the engine run for a bit over 10 minutes, temp gauge was reading just above the first marker when I shut it off.

As I'm reading the manual, waiting for the engine to cool enough to drain the flush out, she gives a little hiss, then another, then an almighty "POP" and a gush of water...  :fp dang...

So, whatever went 'pop' was somewhere above the back of the engine, if I fill the radiator up it'll eventually start gushing down the sides at the back, but everything's crammed in so tight back there I can't see what's going on.  I took a breather to have a cuppa and Onesie called to see how it was all going, we had a bit of a chat speculating what it might be, he had a look over an engine on his bench for inspiration.  Definitely something right up in the back... So, back to the shed, air cleaner off, fuel tank out, I'm still not far enough in to find what blew (did discover that the overflow tube & T-section for the two right carbies is missing though...), but it's time to call it a day...

I'm guessing (and here's where I'd love some input) my next move will have to be to remove the carbs to get a better look further along the top of the engine, it looks very wet under there, so I'm sure the damage is further back still somewhere.

Even when I do find either a dislodged hose (best case), a split hose (about what I'm imagining) or the engine blown in half (my paranoia won't let me rule that one out just yet...), there still remains the question of WHY did enough pressure build up to cause that? The radiator cap looks to be in good condition, however there was a little gunk under it when I first opened it up (gelatinous gloop, my guess is from the suspected mix of red & green coolants).  Any and all suggestions would be warmly welcomed!  But for now, I'm off to dream about riding through the hills...


...on a purple unicorn...  :popcorn
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Online alans1100

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2015, 02:48:37 AM »
If it looks wet under the carbs it quite possibly could be either one of the hoses that bring the coolant from the engine to the thermostat housing.

Here's my hoses when removed at 150,000 km (14 years old) for the timing belt. They should have been done earlier as they weren't far from bursting. The elbows that sometimes crack are in the picture below them. They mount to the heads between the inlet ports. They were ok but I replaced them anyway. http://ozstoc.com/index.php?topic=2977.msg34375#msg34375



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Offline SteveR

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2015, 09:38:38 AM »
Alrighty, here's hoping that's it. Are generic hoses OK in there, or do these need to come from Honda? I'll head out there shortly and get the carbs off and see what's under there... Hate it when a simple maintenance job turns into a whole weekend tear-down!
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Offline AliSTair

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2015, 10:00:45 AM »
sorry to hear about your unexpected strip-down. The two uspides of this are that you will learn you bike well and  I will know who to come to whenever mine plays up.

If you need a break, feel free to take mine for a spin to test out the screen!
 

Offline SteveR

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2015, 10:21:50 AM »

...and  I will know who to come to whenever mine plays up...

Haha! Always looking on the bright side hey mate?! ;)

If you need a break, feel free to take mine for a spin to test out the screen!
Thanks for the offer, hopefully I'll make some good headway today to deserve a break later this afternoon, I'll be in touch if I do.
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Online alans1100

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2015, 11:29:51 AM »
Alrighty, here's hoping that's it. Are generic hoses OK in there, or do these need to come from Honda? I'll head out there shortly and get the carbs off and see what's under there... Hate it when a simple maintenance job turns into a whole weekend tear-down!
If you can right diameter hose then generic would be ok.

I had had a faulty thermostat for a little while and since the timing belt was coming up I decided to do the cooling system at the same time. All hoses, thermostat and coolant and the reserve tank got added later as it cracked. There was a moment when I decided to let those two old hoses stay as I couldn't get the carbs out at first. As you can see from the pictures I would have had to go in there anyway. Better to do it all at once instead of twice.
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Offline SteveR

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2015, 11:56:04 AM »

...There was a moment when I decided to let those two old hoses stay as I couldn't get the carbs out at first...

I'm just about to tackle them, are they tricky in general, or were yours just particularly stuck?
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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2015, 12:16:59 PM »



I'm just about to tackle them, are they tricky in general, or were yours just particularly stuck?
They'd been in since new so more like glued in place..lol. A little extra leverage was needed that was all. The rubbers had gone hard as well so new ones in before replacing carbs.
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Offline SteveR

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2015, 02:17:34 PM »
Well, AliSTair popped around to watch the entertainment...

We've spotted the damage, the hose connecting the right head to the thermostat has split open, only problem is, we can't get the bloody carbs out to get to it!!! Can't for the life of me get to the collar screw on the front right carb, very frustrating!  ...any secrets??
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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2015, 02:32:33 PM »
Well, AliSTair popped around to watch the entertainment...

We've spotted the damage, the hose connecting the right head to the thermostat has split open, only problem is, we can't get the bloody carbs out to get to it!!! Can't for the life of me get to the collar screw on the front right carb, very frustrating!  ...any secrets??
I had problems with that one as well........middle of the day and it was like the middle of the night in that space. I ended up using one of those little LED torches and even then it was hard to see even with the dab of white paint on the screw head.
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Offline SteveR

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #10 on: October 25, 2015, 03:40:45 PM »
Well, torches and all, I we couldn't even see the screw head... Tail yes, but no head.

We decided the best move was to just try and get the hose out with the carbies in situ, at least then I can source a new part and feel as though I've accomplished SOMETHING today, and maybe wrestle with the carbs again after a nap...

Managed to manoeuvre the hose out, here she is:
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Offline ppopeye

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #11 on: October 25, 2015, 04:42:13 PM »
You are right. Time for a new one


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Offline ST2UP

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #12 on: October 25, 2015, 05:13:17 PM »
Yep that's broke.....you should get a new one  :Stirpot
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Offline Sicman

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #13 on: October 25, 2015, 05:16:24 PM »
then fired her up and let the engine run for a bit over 10 minutes, temp gauge was reading just above the first marker when I shut it off.

Bet you dont do that again 8)
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Offline SteveR

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #14 on: October 25, 2015, 05:24:48 PM »
Yeah, thanks guys, appreciating the sympathy :P

I've picked up some generic hose (heater hose, the only I could find in the right diameter) rated for 10bar (any NZ members care to translate ;) ),  I'm hoping it'll be alright, but very happy to be corrected BEFORE I install it!


I'm tempted to have a go at getting it in with the carbs still in situ, I'll see how quickly the swear jar fills up and use that to judge whether it was a good idea or not... I am still worried though, what caused the failure? Possibly I didn't get all the air out of the system? Hoping there isn't a blockage somewhere!
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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #15 on: October 25, 2015, 06:33:33 PM »
I am still worried though, what caused the failure? Possibly I didn't get all the air out of the system? Hoping there isn't a blockage somewhere!
More than likely just heat stress. It's the hottest part of the cooling system and not much airflow under the carbs either. Did you replace the thermostat as well?
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Offline ppopeye

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #16 on: October 25, 2015, 06:52:52 PM »
Heat stress and age. Rubber hoses dont last forever. Really. good you found it now and not in the middle of summer


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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #17 on: October 25, 2015, 07:17:26 PM »
Air pocket under heat probably blew that hole out a weak point. You can still see writing on the outside of the hose, so under normal operating conditions that hose may have been good for many more thousands of kms. It is a good opportunity to replace them all and make a good job out of it  :thumb
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Offline SteveR

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #18 on: October 25, 2015, 08:35:50 PM »

Did you replace the thermostat as well?

No I haven't yet, I was just thinking about that this evening, I should give it a boil and make sure it's working. Had absolutely no issues with it before now though.

Air pocket under heat probably blew that hole out a weak point. You can still see writing on the outside of the hose, so under normal operating conditions that hose may have been good for many more thousands of kms. It is a good opportunity to replace them all and make a good job out of it  :thumb

Yeah, the hoses seem to still be in pretty good nick (...other than the gaping hole...), soft and pliable, not brittle or distorted at all. I got a metre of this other hose, so once I'm convinced it's suitable I'll attempt to replace both heads hoses.
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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #19 on: October 25, 2015, 09:10:02 PM »
Yeah, thanks guys, appreciating the sympathy

I've picked up some generic hose (heater hose, the only I could find in the right diameter) rated for 10bar (any NZ members care to translate ;) ),  I'm hoping it'll be alright, but very happy to be corrected BEFORE I install it!


I'm tempted to have a go at getting it in with the carbs still in situ, I'll see how quickly the swear jar fills up and use that to judge whether it was a good idea or not... I am still worried though, what caused the failure? Possibly I didn't get all the air out of the system? Hoping there isn't a blockage somewhere!

10 bar = 1,000 kpa = 145.038 lb/in^2
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Offline SteveR

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #20 on: October 25, 2015, 09:33:34 PM »

10 bar = 1,000 kpa = 145.038 lb/in^2

Ha! Thanks, I guess I was looking for more of a 'yay or nay' kind of conversion ;) but thanks anyway
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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #21 on: October 25, 2015, 09:38:10 PM »
I noticed on the printing in the picture it is car heater hose so it should be good. Same sort of pressures.

Just be careful if you have a tight bend. Moulded hoses won't kink. Heater hose will only bend so far before it kinks when warm. That's why old house often had a wire cage to hold the hose round. I guess cable ties could achieve the desired effect.
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Offline SteveR

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #22 on: October 26, 2015, 09:27:36 AM »

I noticed on the printing in the picture it is car heater hose so it should be good. Same sort of pressures.

Just be careful if you have a tight bend. Moulded hoses won't kink. Heater hose will only bend so far before it kinks when warm. That's why old house often had a wire cage to hold the hose round. I guess cable ties could achieve the desired effect.

Hopefully it'll be alright, there aren't any serious bends in the head->thermostat hose, fingers crossed!

Does anyone have a link to the parts fiche? I may price OEM hoses and check their availability, just in case...
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Offline AliSTair

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #23 on: October 26, 2015, 09:35:01 AM »
http://www.st-1100.com/st1100-parts-fiche-water-pipe-st1100r.html


I think this is the right one...but I'm no expert
 

Offline West Aussie Glen

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Re: HELP! Radiator flush gone wrong, snap crackle and POP!
« Reply #24 on: October 26, 2015, 10:20:03 AM »

Does anyone have a link to the parts fiche? I may price OEM hoses and check their availability, just in case...


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