ST1300 loves to lean...

[CallMeSteve]

Hey all,

I'll preface this by saying that I've had the ST for only a month, and prior to this my last bike was a CX500 in the 1990's. So I have a long way to go in terms of getting comfortable and competent on this machine, and I'm not looking to blame anything on the machine which is more likely to be my lack of experience and capability.

The handling of the ST is very different from my memory of previous bikes. My CB400, CB900 and CX500 all required a hefty countersteer push on the bars to get them to really lean into a tight corner.  In contrast the ST seems very eager to lean - sometimes a little too eager. I've never felt that it was going to slip from under me - it feels very sure-footed - but I sometimes head into a slow corner, e.g. at intersections, and find the bike leans much further than I intended. Wifie gets a little freaked out 

I found a reference from Shiney to this from 2012 : "The first corner I took on the 1300 I almost dropped it on its side, it just was so easy and eager to lean, a bit of acceleration fixed this and the side of the bike stayed off the road."   That sums up what I'm experiencing.

Apart from just getting used to the machine, does anyone have experience of possible causes / fixes for this ?  I think it has the original tires still - are tires at all relevant ?

Thanks,
Steve

[ST2UP]

They are a very nimble bike for there size and weight...Like Shiney I too noticed moving from 1100 to 1300 it likes to tip in with ease.

We have just learned to love it....

[StinkyPete]

My advice would be to be patiently learn the feel and steering characteristics of a bike which is much heavier and with an entirely different feel to the bikes you have ridden in the past.  Find some twisties, leave the dearly beloved home, and slowly and carefully explore how the bike steers, and your confidence in the ST's solid handling will grow.

[johnnyYTED]

 
I not long ago purchased an ST1300 and got off my ST1100. this weekend gone, I got out on it for a decent ride, Hwy, mountain twiSTies and suburbia roads and didn't notice it wanting to lay down, I muST say though I had ridden a ST1300 for a month or 2 previously but don't remember having what your experiencing.
Like others, I say get out and ride in all sorts of conditions and you will soon learn how nimble and sure-footed the bike is. 

[Lorien Vale]

Hey Steve. I too have only just got on the ST after riding a CX500 20 odd years ago. I know what you mean and I was thinking it was just me, but the more I ride it the less I notice it so stick with it I'm sure it will be normal behaviour to us soon enough. I was pleasantly surprised how light it feels on the road compared to lugging it around of the road, especially if it falls over!!!!.

[Biggles]

As hinted in the Shiney reference, keep a trickle of power on in tight corners ready to accelerate out and you'll lose that "tipping over feeling".
In very tight turns like U-turns, you need to do the rear brake drag against clutch slip or you will drop it. AND do please be sure to be in 1st when you are doing that unless it's across three lanes and then use 2nd and keep the speed up.

[Gadget]

I found after changing from Battlax front and Shinko rear to a Michelin PR3 front and back that it meshed in a lot easier. It had been a bit heavy before that.
After a couple of months of daily commute, I didn't notice it any more and loved it on the mountains.

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[Brian]

Dont lean them to far cos you'll start scraping things like ya hero pegs........side of the belly pan.....centre stand......

[Brock]

The ST1100 too loves to lean, I have scraped the pegs and the boot a time or two. At no time did I feel about to fall.

My Son once asked after a ride on the back " Dad, do you know how close you are to the ground??"

My answer, " nope, I dont look."

[Gadget]

I scraped the pegs on my ST1300 heaps of times. So much that I was close to replacing the wear bolts.

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[Williamson]

..... does anyone have experience of possible causes / fixes for this ?  I think it has the original tires still - are tires at all relevant ?

Original tyres?  You'll need to remind me re. age of tyres, km, condition (even wear, flat spots, etc...) and pressures. 

Even with less than 10,000km on the OEM Dunlops on my ST1300's handling went "off" and would dip uncomfortably (for me) into a corner or two.  The 10,000km was mostly with two-up, towing the trailer and a lot of that on straight, flat roads.  The tyre had developed a flat square off profile around the circumference.

New tyres fixed that little problem.

[Gadget]

The reverse problem occurs with a half flat rear as I found out. I was pushing hard to get it to lean over. Luckily only a couple of hundred meters from home and the compressors.

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[tding]

When I got my ST1300 it had a 160 width  rear tire fitted instead of the 170 width tire which made the bike fall into corners very quickly.
    

[Ace]

Firstly,  great to hear about previous cx500 owners here as I still have a few of them in the stable. Fun bikes and so easy to work on!
I also just moved over to an ST (1100) and agree with everything above in that the ST rolls beautifully into corners and leans far more than the cx range. My wife commented on it on our first outing. I realised that the ST is so sure and easy that I can take all corners at a far higher speed than the top heavy CX. Our new ST is the best bike I/we have ever been on and we look forward to lots of RTE's 
Chris

[alans1100]

I've had two CXs - TC or Turbo plus a standard one.

The Turbo was the best bike I had until I bought the 1100A though it did have generator issues which was a pain to fix.

[CallMeSteve]

Great to read all the interesting and nostalgic replies.  Thanks Biggles for your suggestions - spot on. 

One bad habit I had to ditch was upshifting from first to second mid-corner.  I used to do that on the old 400 and 500 otherwise it would be screaming at the end of the turn but it may have been bad practice even then. Starting from the lights and taking the entire corner before upshifting works a treat. Plus it leaves open the naughty opportunity to gun out of the corner in first and whistle down the road at light-speed 

I am starting to lose the panic and adopt more of a crazed grin when I go into corners because it's insane just how solid this machine feels in twisties. Still lots of practice needed though.

CX500/650 Turbo - How I used to drool over those machines. No idea what they were actually like to ride but they was drool-worthy anyway 

[Skip]

I suggest it will go quicker through corners than you give it credit for. When I'm out with learners or beginners, you are naturally going slower and it does tend to turn in quicker than when riding on my own at my own speed. But confidence is key. I'm in no way suggesting that you ride outside of your comfort level, but as others implied, that confidence will come with time. Don't give up too early. The 1300 is a fantastic bike.

[CallMeSteve]

I thought I’d report back in on this thread I started just after I got the ‘nearly new ST1300’.

Part of the solution has been just getting to know the bike and how it handles. I still have a way to go. I’m mean let’s face it - the last bike I rode was half the weight and was 25 years ago. I’ve been learning a lot about cornering, balance and slow speed handling but I feel I’ve only just started on the learning process.

But the other part was definitely related to the tyres. STrudel had 8000k on the clock when I got him and would have been halfway through his OEM Battlaxes. He’s just turned over 15000k and needed new front and rear. I went for a pair of PR4GTs.  The difference in handling is very noticeable. The PR4s are even lighter and more willing to tip into corners, but they are much more progressive and predictable than the Battlax.

With the Battlax even after several months I was still finding sometimes I’d tip into a corner and end up with either more or less lean than what I was expecting, where’s the PR4s are much more confidence inspiring. I don’t really know why this would be. Perhaps the previous owner put on 8000k of highway riding and flattened them a bit, but I’m guessing.

Just thought I’d feed back my experience. Someone might have some insight.

[Biggles]

How many years old were the OEM tyres?  Tyres don't age gracefully.
Also, PR4GTs are generations ahead of the Battleaxes in development.  They are one of the best tyres available, heartily agreed to by many experienced riders.  The GTs have stiffer walls than standards which make them ideal for our heavy bikes.

[CallMeSteve]

The bike is plated early 2014 so that puts the battlaxes to be at least 4 years old. Good point about the age. I’ve not previously had tyres hang around long enough for that to become an issue.
IMO good tyres are well worth the expense. I learned the same lesson with my 4L turbo Falcon.